Discussion:
[Arm-netbook] crowd-funding landing page is up!
Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2014-11-04 07:51:59 UTC
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https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop

hooraay :) just a sign-up page for now. demo cpu card arrived yesterday.

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Paul NeoStormer
2014-11-04 21:58:52 UTC
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Fantastic! Already send it to a few I know were interested early on. Hope
to be one of the first backers :)
Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop
hooraay :) just a sign-up page for now. demo cpu card arrived yesterday.
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Christopher Havel
2014-11-04 22:33:01 UTC
Permalink
Sent it to the two friends of mine who I thought were the likeliest to have
any potential interest...

While I hope the crowdfunding will go phenomenally well, I should probably
point out that there needs to be a contingency plan for what to do if the
response isn't even lukewarm... ;)
Post by Paul NeoStormer
Fantastic! Already send it to a few I know were interested early on. Hope
to be one of the first backers :)
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 12:51 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <
Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop
hooraay :) just a sign-up page for now. demo cpu card arrived yesterday.
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Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2014-11-04 22:50:46 UTC
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On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 10:33 PM, Christopher Havel
Post by Christopher Havel
Sent it to the two friends of mine who I thought were the likeliest to have
any potential interest...
thanks chris.
Post by Christopher Havel
While I hope the crowdfunding will go phenomenally well, I should probably
point out that there needs to be a contingency plan for what to do if the
response isn't even lukewarm... ;)
we set the bar (MOQ) quite low and the... can't call it sale price
because that's not actually what it is... :) we set the "gift level
where you will happen to receive a reward" high enough to cover even a
modest order quantity.

and, the plan is, that if it goes above that then YAY! we can put in
some fantastic extra things like additional OSes, FCC/CE Certification
paid-for, and a few extra things besides.

so depending on what the volumes are, it develops more polish.

but the nice touch which is being investigated right now is a
beautiful _wooden_ case. we can do that because it's such a low-power
computer. it'll be available as an option.

l.

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Christopher Havel
2014-11-04 22:53:23 UTC
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a beautiful _wooden_ case. we can do that because it's such a low-power
computer. it'll be available as an option.
OOOooooohh... that sounds nice :D do we have even a vague idea of what
it'll look like? Oh -- and if we don't -- I'm an artist, would you like
some concepts? :D ( /shamelessplug )
Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2014-11-05 00:55:42 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 10:53 PM, Christopher Havel
a beautiful _wooden_ case. we can do that because it's such a low-power
computer. it'll be available as an option.
OOOooooohh... that sounds nice :D do we have even a vague idea of what it'll
look like?
metal fascia plates and rounded curved wood panels.
Oh -- and if we don't -- I'm an artist, would you like some
concepts? :D ( /shamelessplug )
yeah of course!
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Christopher Havel
2014-11-05 01:02:29 UTC
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Curved wood is expensive ;) do you have a concept image so far?
Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 10:53 PM, Christopher Havel
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 5:50 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <
a beautiful _wooden_ case. we can do that because it's such a low-power
computer. it'll be available as an option.
OOOooooohh... that sounds nice :D do we have even a vague idea of what
it'll
look like?
metal fascia plates and rounded curved wood panels.
Oh -- and if we don't -- I'm an artist, would you like some
concepts? :D ( /shamelessplug )
yeah of course!
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http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
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Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2014-11-05 01:53:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Christopher Havel
Curved wood is expensive ;)
ehh well luckily it'll be small. remember that these are the same
people who helped with the novena laptop
Post by Christopher Havel
do you have a concept image so far?
naah. brushed aluminium front and back plates (see photos of
micro-desktop for holes) then case is 4.5in x 3.5in x about 0.5 maybe
0.6in.

cost shouldnt be too bad. two halves wood so not a 1 piece.
Post by Christopher Havel
Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 10:53 PM, Christopher Havel
a beautiful _wooden_ case. we can do that because it's such a low-power
computer. it'll be available as an option.
OOOooooohh... that sounds nice :D do we have even a vague idea of what it'll
look like?
metal fascia plates and rounded curved wood panels.
Oh -- and if we don't -- I'm an artist, would you like some
concepts? :D ( /shamelessplug )
yeah of course!
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Sen
Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2014-11-04 22:45:28 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 9:58 PM, Paul NeoStormer
Fantastic! Already send it to a few I know were interested early on. Hope to
be one of the first backers :)
ehh good man. btw i passed on the (deobfuscated but public) list of
addresses (a huuuge percentage of them known to be bounces...) from
the preorders page, along with a note to be sent out as the first
message explaining that's where the list came from, so that people
don't get annoyed thinking it's an unsolicited message.

l.

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Christopher Havel
2014-11-04 22:48:52 UTC
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Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
ehh good man.
Thanks! Not to be a pest, but contingency plans are good ;) I hope there is
one and that I just missed the memo about it...
Nico Rikken
2014-11-05 20:17:24 UTC
Permalink
Great news!

I'm already notifying my friends about this.
In that regard: how 'open' and 'free' is the EOMA68 standard? I have
seen many specs and details on the elinux wiki, on the rhombus-tech
website and on this mailinglist (so open), but I also remember a few
emails about 'EOMA Compliancy' around the 27th of May this year (how
free?). I then mentioned the Arduino model and am curious if any
decisions have been made on this point.

Kind regards,
Nico Rikken
Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop
hooraay :) just a sign-up page for now. demo cpu card arrived yesterday.
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Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2014-11-05 20:57:27 UTC
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Post by Nico Rikken
Great news!
I'm already notifying my friends about this.
great.
Post by Nico Rikken
In that regard: how 'open' and 'free' is the EOMA68 standard?
it's open: anyone may implement interoperable variants, however due
to the risk of physical injury if someone gets the implementation
wrong it would be highly irresponsible of me not to go after anyone
that gets the standard wrong.

is that a reasonable and responsible thing to do, do you think? to
protect people from potential harm?
Post by Nico Rikken
I have
seen many specs
there is only one and there will only ever be one place, and it's here:
http://elinux.org/Embedded_Open_Modular_Architecture/EOMA-68
Post by Nico Rikken
and details on the elinux wiki, on the rhombus-tech
website and on this mailinglist (so open), but I also remember a few
emails about 'EOMA Compliancy' around the 27th of May this year (how
free?). I then mentioned the Arduino model and am curious if any
decisions have been made on this point.
it's very simple: i am the guardian of the EOMA standards and i
*will* not let the standards either be brought into disrepute nor let
people come to harm through incompetent 3rd party implementation. it
is completely irrelevant whether they are open hardware teams or
proprietary companies.

this is *mass volume*. it's intended for kids toys, day-to-day
electronics and for use by grandma, your parents, and the average
teenager. as such i have a duty of responsibility to protect such
people and there is absolutely nothing that anyone can say which will
convince me *not* to take that responsibility extremely seriously.

the arduino model expects the end-user to be an educated and
responsible electronics expert, and the volumes of sales are a
fraction of those for which EOMA68 has been designed. the chances
therefore of someone killing themselves or others around them through
the incompetence of a third party hardware implementer are really
quite remote, but that is NOT the case with the EOMA68 standards.

so i will not charge a royalty for open hardware implementations but
i *WILL* expect them to go through a proper and full Certification
process. statistically the risks are simply far too great to permit
anything else.

now, if this was a project that was of similar scope (comparatively
limited) and reach (comparatively limited) to the Arduino project [an
electronics hobbyist project], then their model would be relevant.

so - is that now clear?

l.

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Nico Rikken
2014-11-06 00:24:57 UTC
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Thanks for the clear answer. That indeed sounds reasonable and
responsible, especially considering the use-case of less-informed users.
I'm very interested in what to expect and what that would imply in
practice and how it would be formalized. Hunting down incorrect
implementations (as a rephrase) seems somewhat hostile. I would however
not know what would be the 'right' approach, so I am not able to judge.
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