[Arm-netbook] Laptop PCB schematics

[Internet]

I recently walked through the files on hands.com and found the schematics for the 3 PCBs of the laptop. However, there are multiple versions (PDFs) and I would like to know whether those are the latest. If help is appreciated, I would like to take a look at the schematics. I really want this project to be successful and offering help is probably the best thing I can do ;)

Julius Lehmann

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

thanks julius. highest numbered versions. redesign needed. creating a
block diagram (SVG) similar to miguel's eom68 console would be really handy.

l.

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
I recently walked through the files on
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEAAHgqV-woAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYnfohNbEUhQHPRs-zIKQPgPBHfAAGAjk/1/t9QxNRQwiA8fZqtpm77ocg/aHR0cDovL2hhbmRzLmNvbQ>
hands.com
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEAAHgqV-woAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYnfohNbEUhQHPRs-zIKQPgPBHfAAGAjk/2/CY8ILpN6Ld9V3rBGN7-BgQ/aHR0cDovL2hhbmRzLmNvbQ>
and found the schematics for the 3 PCBs of the laptop. However, there are
multiple versions (PDFs) and I would like to know whether those are the
latest. If help is appreciated, I would like to take a look at the
schematics. I really want this project to be successful and offering help
is probably the best thing I can do ;)
Julius Lehmann
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[i***@devpi.de]

Could you send me a link with the block diagram you described? That
would be really useful because then I know what you are talking about ;)
(I hope we are talking about the same thing ... I was referring to
electronic circuits 
)

Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
thanks julius. highest numbered versions. redesign needed. creating
a block diagram (SVG) similar to miguel's eom68 console would be
really handy.
l.
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
I recently walked through the files on hands.com
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEAAHgqV-woAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYnfohNbEUhQHPRs-zIKQPgPBHfAAGAjk/2/CY8ILpN6Ld9V3rBGN7-BgQ/aHR0cDovL2hhbmRzLmNvbQ>
and found the schematics for the 3 PCBs of the laptop. However,
there are multiple versions (PDFs) and I would like to know
whether those are the latest. If help is appreciated, I would like
to take a look at the schematics. I really want this project to be
successful and offering help is probably the best thing I can do ;)
Julius Lehmann
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
<http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook>
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by i***@devpi.de
Could you send me a link with the block diagram you described?

doesn't exist. that's what i was saying: it would be really helpful if you
could ask questions after reviewing the highest-revision PDFs in order to
make it.

l.

[Internet]

I see. sorry for the misunderstanding ...

Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by i***@devpi.de
Could you send me a link with the block diagram you described?

doesn't exist. that's what i was saying: it would be really helpful if you
could ask questions after reviewing the highest-revision PDFs in order to
make it.
l.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Parobalth]

I think this is "Miguel's eoma68 console diagram Luke wrote about:
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/pipermail/arm-netbook/2014-September/010192.html

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by Parobalth
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/pipermail/arm-netbook/2014-September/010192.html

yehhh that's the one. having a 3-PCB version of that would be
*really* handy, plus, julius, you'd learn very very quickly what was
going on.

btw sorry i have about 3 topics i haven't been keeping up-to-date
with, i know what they are, i haven't forgotten.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@fil

[Internet]

I already started looking at PCB3 which is the one with all the power supply stuff on it. As this one is not too complex I think I am good to go, even without such a block diagram. Do you mind if I annotate the PDF file with notes or should I keep suggestions separate?

Julius

Post by Parobalth
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/pipermail/arm-netbook/2014-September/010192.html
yehhh that's the one. having a 3-PCB version of that would be
*really* handy, plus, julius, you'd learn very very quickly what was
going on.
btw sorry i have about 3 topics i haven't been keeping up-to-date
with, i know what they are, i haven't forgotten.
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
I already started looking at PCB3 which is the one with all the power supply stuff on it. As this one is not too complex I think I am good to go, even without such a block diagram.

cool. the thing is, it gets complicated from there - what powers
what, what controls what.

Post by Internet
Do you mind if I annotate the PDF file with notes or should I keep suggestions separate?

you're welcome to do so but as it is a write-only one-way output from
a controlled source, annotating such a write-only auto-generated
document would be a puzzling thing to do, from that perspective.

the general rule is, comments and discussion is best kept here, then
once useful conclusions or information are made which best record the
"state of play" those are best placed onto a wiki page, even if it's
just cut/paste directly out of the discussion.

that results in an easy way for the discussion to be picked up at any
time by reading (and referring) to the wiki page, even after weeks or
months have elapsed.

anywhere here http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/
would do.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-net

[Internet]

I was talking about the inbuilt function of PDFs to make annotations ...
e.g. in okular you can put notes anywhere you want and then overwrite the original PDF. AFAIK those notes should be accessible in every other viewer.

Additionally, those notes go into a discussion, so it is easier to keep track of them. Duplication is probably not an issue ;)

Julius

On Feb 11, 2017, at 13:14, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <***@lkcl.net> wrote:

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

On Sat, Feb 11, 2017 at 12:05 PM, Internet <***@devpi.de> wrote:


I already started looking at PCB3 which is the one with all the power supply stuff on it. As this one is not too complex I think I am good to go, even without such a block diagram.



cool. the thing is, it gets complicated from there - what powers
what, what controls what.


Do you mind if I annotate the PDF file with notes or should I keep suggestions separate?



you're welcome to do so but as it is a write-only one-way output from
a controlled source, annotating such a write-only auto-generated
document would be a puzzling thing to do, from that perspective.

the general rule is, comments and discussion is best kept here, then
once useful conclusions or information are made which best record the
"state of play" those are best placed onto a wiki page, even if it's
just cut/paste directly out of the discussion.

that results in an easy way for the discussion to be picked up at any
time by reading (and referring) to the wiki page, even after weeks or
months have elapsed.

anywhere here http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/
would do.

l.


arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
I already started looking at PCB3 which is the one with all the power

supply stuff on it. As this one is not too complex I think I am good to
go, even without such a block diagram.
cool. the thing is, it gets complicated from there - what powers
what, what controls what.

Post by Internet
Do you mind if I annotate the PDF file with notes or should I keep

suggestions separate?
you're welcome to do so but as it is a write-only one-way output from
a controlled source, annotating such a write-only auto-generated
document would be a puzzling thing to do, from that perspective.
the general rule is, comments and discussion is best kept here, then
once useful conclusions or information are made which best record the
"state of play" those are best placed onto a wiki page, even if it's
just cut/paste directly out of the discussion.
that results in an easy way for the discussion to be picked up at any
time by reading (and referring) to the wiki page, even after weeks or
months have elapsed.
anywhere here http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/
would do.
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by Internet
I was talking about the inbuilt function of PDFs to make annotations ...
e.g. in okular you can put notes anywhere you want and then overwrite the
original PDF. AFAIK those notes should be accessible in every other viewer.

when i auto-generate the next version of the PDF from the schematics,
increasing the revision number in the process thus outputting a completely
different document, those annotations that you are kindly considering
making would not be included, would they?

if however you find it easier to do annotations on the PDF than it is to
put them in a separate document feel free to do what you find easiest.
particularly as it's 2D and text is, obviously, linear. however, there,
there's quadrant numbering and you can also take image snapshots
(screenshots) then write on those... not as good but it's what i use to
communicate with factories.

ultimately though notes would be great here rather than anywhere else
http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/

l.

[Internet]

You are absolutely right. Putting comments separately is the best thing to do. I just found the edit button on rhombus-tech.net ;), this should definitely make things easier ...

On Feb 11, 2017, at 14:20, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <***@lkcl.net> wrote:



On Sat, Feb 11, 2017 at 12:26 PM, Internet <***@devpi.de> wrote:

I was talking about the inbuilt function of PDFs to make annotations ...
e.g. in okular you can put notes anywhere you want and then overwrite the original PDF. AFAIK those notes should be accessible in every other viewer.


 when i auto-generate the next version of the PDF from the schematics, increasing the revision number in the process thus outputting a completely different document, those annotations that you are kindly considering making would not be included, would they? if however you find it easier to do annotations on the PDF than it is to put them in a separate document feel free to do what you find easiest.  particularly as it's 2D and text is, obviously, linear.  however, there, there's quadrant numbering and you can also take image snapshots (screenshots) then write on those... not as good but it's what i use to communicate with factories.
ultimately though notes would be great here rather than anywhere elsehttp://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/
l.
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

Post by Internet

Post by Internet
I was talking about the inbuilt function of PDFs to make annotations

...

Post by Internet
e.g. in okular you can put notes anywhere you want and then overwrite

the

Post by Internet
original PDF. AFAIK those notes should be accessible in every other

viewer.
when i auto-generate the next version of the PDF from the schematics,
increasing the revision number in the process thus outputting a
completely
different document, those annotations that you are kindly considering
making would not be included, would they?
if however you find it easier to do annotations on the PDF than it is to
put them in a separate document feel free to do what you find easiest.
particularly as it's 2D and text is, obviously, linear. however, there,
there's quadrant numbering and you can also take image snapshots
(screenshots) then write on those... not as good but it's what i use to
communicate with factories.
ultimately though notes would be great here rather than anywhere else
http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/
l.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
You are absolutely right. Putting comments separately is the best thing to
do. I just found the edit button on rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/ADsAAGXxthMAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYnxLAWdhq4IN3QeehFdPtsyxvowAGAjk/1/9vezu01ILOhdHLCLCGU06A/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQ>
;), this should definitely make things easier ...

yay, magic. also stops duplication and AOL-style me-too postings. if
anyone remembers the AOL bbs...

l.

[Internet]

First look at PCB3 is finished, it is of course possible I am missing
something. Anyways, following caught my eyes:

1. the usb otg charger ic has two capacitors between regn and ground,
total value: 11.5uF, datasheet says 1uF. probably no issue though
2. 10k thermistor for the otg charger is connected to voltage divider
and through another thermistor to bat-v (fuel guage), datasheet says
it should be connected to ground (i am not to sure about the guage
though, reference application is pretty chaotic and complex)
3. status leds should be connected to sys-v (nothing to do if dvcc = sys-v)
4. EOMA68-5V0 is not connected to anything, this results in an
unpowered card on pcb1 (which is bad); should probably be connected
to vcc-5v0)
5. level shifter is completely unnecessary because lcd-vcc = vrefttl =
3v3; connect 10k pullup resistors to vrefttl and add pullup for
chg_irq to vrefttl
6. because eoma68-i2c is not used on this pcb remove pullups

I hope this helps and if I misunderstood something, please let me know.
The fuel guage circuit is more complex than expected, I let you know if
there is an issue.

Do you want me to put all this on rhombus-tech.net? If so, could you
give me some instructions where and how to put it? Additionally, to edit
the pages I need some kind of account creation password 


Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
You are absolutely right. Putting comments separately is the best
thing to do. I just found the edit button on rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/ADsAAGXxthMAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYnxLAWdhq4IN3QeehFdPtsyxvowAGAjk/1/9vezu01ILOhdHLCLCGU06A/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQ>
;), this should definitely make things easier ...
yay, magic. also stops duplication and AOL-style me-too postings.
if anyone remembers the AOL bbs...
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
First look at PCB3 is finished, it is of course possible I am missing
1. the usb otg charger ic has two capacitors between regn and ground,
total value: 11.5uF, datasheet says 1uF. probably no issue though
2. 10k thermistor for the otg charger is connected to voltage divider
and through another thermistor to bat-v (fuel guage), datasheet says it
should be connected to ground (i am not to sure about the guage though,
reference application is pretty chaotic and complex)
3. status leds should be connected to sys-v (nothing to do if dvcc = sys-v)
4. EOMA68-5V0 is not connected to anything, this results in an
unpowered card on pcb1 (which is bad); should probably be connected to
vcc-5v0)
5. level shifter is completely unnecessary because lcd-vcc = vrefttl =
3v3; connect 10k pullup resistors to vrefttl and add pullup for chg_irq to
vrefttl
TI bat IC is 1.8v.. wasn't happy with that.
1. because eoma68-i2c is not used on this pcb remove pullups

_great_. encourages me to take a look and check.

Post by Internet
I hope this helps and if I misunderstood something, please let me know.
The fuel guage circuit is more complex than expected, I let you know if
there is an issue.
Do you want me to put all this on rhombus-tech.net? If so, could you give
me some instructions where and how to put it?

http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcb2/ then just work it
out, put whatever you feel is appropriate and i'll review it and move /
adjust if necessary.

Post by Internet
Additionally, to edit the pages I need some kind of account creation
password 


ah! sorry, i added that recently after there were attacks on the page --
it's "passwordreqd"

Post by Internet
Julius Lehmann
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAHqt4STUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYoHFzFqkoe5j4S8W7hrvGQMA-BwAGAjk/1/MkNnISYr4-hglOBjM6YUqw/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY3Jvd2RzdXBwbHkuY29tL2VvbWE2OA>

Post by Internet
You are absolutely right. Putting comments separately is the best thing
to do. I just found the edit button on rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAHqt4STUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYoHFzFqkoe5j4S8W7hrvGQMA-BwAGAjk/2/0gqbLOpYPVPZzmn-W6fIhw/aHR0cDovL3QyMjQubWp0Lmx1L2xuay9BRHNBQUdYeHRoTUFBQUFBQUFBQUFHYkUyd2tBQVNIbEZOVUFBQUFBQUFaSGdBQllueExBV2RocTRJTjNRZWVoRmRQdHN5eHZvd0FHQWprLzEvOXZlenUwMUlMT2hkSExDTENHVTA2QS9hSFIwY0RvdkwzSm9iMjFpZFhNdGRHVmphQzV1WlhR>
;), this should definitely make things easier ...

yay, magic. also stops duplication and AOL-style me-too postings. if
anyone remembers the AOL bbs...
l.
_______________________________________________
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[i***@devpi.de]

hey luke,

I just wanted to put my suggestions on rhombus-tech.net but
unfortunately i couldn't figure out how to add a new subpage. to keep
everything tidy and clear this would be really helpful 


i also updated the specification for the pcb connectors, there was
something wrong between pcb3 and pcb1:
sys-v was 4.2v directly from the battery but it is 5v and the first pin
is ground instead of usb_otg_5v0

i will update the other specifications as well as i walk through the
other schematics 


Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
First look at PCB3 is finished, it is of course possible I am
1. the usb otg charger ic has two capacitors between regn and
ground, total value: 11.5uF, datasheet says 1uF. probably no
issue though
2. 10k thermistor for the otg charger is connected to voltage
divider and through another thermistor to bat-v (fuel guage),
datasheet says it should be connected to ground (i am not to
sure about the guage though, reference application is pretty
chaotic and complex)
3. status leds should be connected to sys-v (nothing to do if dvcc = sys-v)
4. EOMA68-5V0 is not connected to anything, this results in an
unpowered card on pcb1 (which is bad); should probably be
connected to vcc-5v0)
5. level shifter is completely unnecessary because lcd-vcc =
vrefttl = 3v3; connect 10k pullup resistors to vrefttl and add
pullup for chg_irq to vrefttl
TI bat IC is 1.8v.. wasn't happy with that.
1. because eoma68-i2c is not used on this pcb remove pullups
_great_. encourages me to take a look and check.
I hope this helps and if I misunderstood something, please let me
know. The fuel guage circuit is more complex than expected, I let
you know if there is an issue.
Do you want me to put all this on rhombus-tech.net
<http://rhombus-tech.net>? If so, could you give me some
instructions where and how to put it?
http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcb2/ then just
work it out, put whatever you feel is appropriate and i'll review it
and move / adjust if necessary.
Additionally, to edit the pages I need some kind of account
creation password 

ah! sorry, i added that recently after there were attacks on the page
-- it's "passwordreqd"
Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAHqt4STUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYoHFzFqkoe5j4S8W7hrvGQMA-BwAGAjk/1/MkNnISYr4-hglOBjM6YUqw/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY3Jvd2RzdXBwbHkuY29tL2VvbWE2OA>
You are absolutely right. Putting comments separately is the
best thing to do. I just found the edit button on
rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAHqt4STUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYoHFzFqkoe5j4S8W7hrvGQMA-BwAGAjk/2/0gqbLOpYPVPZzmn-W6fIhw/aHR0cDovL3QyMjQubWp0Lmx1L2xuay9BRHNBQUdYeHRoTUFBQUFBQUFBQUFHYkUyd2tBQVNIbEZOVUFBQUFBQUFaSGdBQllueExBV2RocTRJTjNRZWVoRmRQdHN5eHZvd0FHQWprLzEvOXZlenUwMUlMT2hkSExDTENHVTA2QS9hSFIwY0RvdkwzSm9iMjFpZFhNdGRHVmphQzV1WlhR>
;), this should definitely make things easier ...
yay, magic. also stops duplication and AOL-style me-too
postings. if anyone remembers the AOL bbs...
l.
_______________________________________________
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAHqt4STUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYoHFzFqkoe5j4S8W7hrvGQMA-BwAGAjk/3/QzsVz1TKCdXr54efyTuzyg/aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnBoY29tcC5jby51ay9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2FybS1uZXRib29r>

_______________________________________________ arm-netbook
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
<http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook> Send
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by i***@devpi.de
hey luke,
I just wanted to put my suggestions on rhombus-tech.net but unfortunately
i couldn't figure out how to add a new subpage. to keep everything tidy and
clear this would be really helpful 


just add text leave it to me i'll git pull what you add then use a text
editor it's a lot easier.

Post by i***@devpi.de
i also updated the specification for the pcb connectors, there was
sys-v was 4.2v directly from the battery but it is 5v and the first pin is
ground instead of usb_otg_5v0

yep i know. i'm adding a 5v boost converter to PCB3.

Post by i***@devpi.de
i will update the other specifications as well as i walk through the other
schematics 

Julius Lehmann
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEEAIEm6x_IAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqHXBu7svXnqrQGqioHzcKxJUzQAGAjk/1/GJuXJr4EE30kGpseDsELXw/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY3Jvd2RzdXBwbHkuY29tL2VvbWE2OA>

Post by Internet
First look at PCB3 is finished, it is of course possible I am missing
1. the usb otg charger ic has two capacitors between regn and ground,
total value: 11.5uF, datasheet says 1uF. probably no issue though
2. 10k thermistor for the otg charger is connected to voltage divider
and through another thermistor to bat-v (fuel guage), datasheet says it
should be connected to ground (i am not to sure about the guage though,
reference application is pretty chaotic and complex)
3. status leds should be connected to sys-v (nothing to do if dvcc = sys-v)
4. EOMA68-5V0 is not connected to anything, this results in an
unpowered card on pcb1 (which is bad); should probably be connected to
vcc-5v0)
5. level shifter is completely unnecessary because lcd-vcc = vrefttl
= 3v3; connect 10k pullup resistors to vrefttl and add pullup for chg_irq
to vrefttl
TI bat IC is 1.8v.. wasn't happy with that.
1. because eoma68-i2c is not used on this pcb remove pullups

_great_. encourages me to take a look and check.

Post by Internet
I hope this helps and if I misunderstood something, please let me know.
The fuel guage circuit is more complex than expected, I let you know if
there is an issue.
Do you want me to put all this on rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEEAIEm6x_IAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqHXBu7svXnqrQGqioHzcKxJUzQAGAjk/2/E35lvbkG1Dh_Uib7FsHh1A/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQ>?
If so, could you give me some instructions where and how to put it?

http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcb2/
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEEAIEm6x_IAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqHXBu7svXnqrQGqioHzcKxJUzQAGAjk/3/x5FUHfaypHPNrYKA7pqXjw/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQvY29tbXVuaXR5X2lkZWFzL2xhcHRvcF8xNWluL3BjYjIv>
then just work it out, put whatever you feel is appropriate and i'll review
it and move / adjust if necessary.

Post by Internet
Additionally, to edit the pages I need some kind of account creation
password 


ah! sorry, i added that recently after there were attacks on the page --
it's "passwordreqd"

Post by Internet
Julius Lehmann
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEEAIEm6x_IAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqHXBu7svXnqrQGqioHzcKxJUzQAGAjk/4/PLIU9yiiO54fWbRpE3PiMA/aHR0cDovL3QyMjQubWp0Lmx1L2xuay9BRU1BSHF0NFNUVUFBQUFBQUFBQUFHYkUyd2tBQVNIbEZOVUFBQUFBQUFaSGdBQllvSEZ6RnFrb2U1ajRTOFc3aHJ2R1FNQS1Cd0FHQWprLzEvTWtObklTWXI0LWhnbE9Cak02WVVxdy9hSFIwY0hNNkx5OTNkM2N1WTNKdmQyUnpkWEJ3YkhrdVkyOXRMMlZ2YldFMk9B>

Post by Internet
You are absolutely right. Putting comments separately is the best thing
to do. I just found the edit button on rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEEAIEm6x_IAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqHXBu7svXnqrQGqioHzcKxJUzQAGAjk/5/jLEjSL9RIxsci-UG9kLing/aHR0cDovL3QyMjQubWp0Lmx1L2xuay9BRU1BSHF0NFNUVUFBQUFBQUFBQUFHYkUyd2tBQVNIbEZOVUFBQUFBQUFaSGdBQllvSEZ6RnFrb2U1ajRTOFc3aHJ2R1FNQS1Cd0FHQWprLzIvMGdxYkxPcFlQVlBaem1uLVc2Zklody9hSFIwY0RvdkwzUXlNalF1YldwMExteDFMMnh1YXk5QlJITkJRVWRZZUhSb1RVRkJRVUZCUVVGQlFVRkhZa1V5ZDJ0QlFWTkliRVpPVlVGQlFVRkJRVUZhU0dkQlFsbHVlRXhCVjJSb2NUUkpUak5SWldWb1JtUlFkSE41ZUhadmQwRkhRV3ByTHpFdk9YWmxlblV3TVVsTVQyaGtTRXhEVEVOSFZUQTJRUzloU0ZJd1kwUnZka3d6U205aU1qRnBaRmhOZEdSSFZtcGhRelYxV2xoUg>
;), this should definitely make things easier ...

yay, magic. also stops duplication and AOL-style me-too postings. if
anyone remembers the AOL bbs...
l.
_______________________________________________
_______________________________________________ arm-netbook mailing list
man/listinfo/arm-netbook
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEEAIEm6x_IAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqHXBu7svXnqrQGqioHzcKxJUzQAGAjk/7/tPmgq8_Ts-6OZD-s4-MdPw/aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnBoY29tcC5jby51ay9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2FybS1uZXRib29r>

_______________________________________________
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

btw annoyinly the BQ27542 is designed for 1.8v operation, and the STM32F072
it's connected to operates its GPIO at 3.3v. suggestions on how to deal
with this appreciated.

l.

[Internet]

For all following suggestions you need a 1.8v power supply (buck converter). First, you could disable internal pullups on the stm and remove all pullups on PCB2 for the signals from the battery ic. Because the signals are probably all opendrain you just need to pullup the signals on pcb3 to 1.8v; either the stm or the battery ic can pull the lines low to "activate" them. The stm should recognize 1.8v as high ...

Second, you could add a txs0104 or two txs0102 (probably cheaper, you can get those from aliexpress) for level shifting. They have internal pullups, so you can remove the other pullup resistors as well.

Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
btw annoyinly the BQ27542 is designed for 1.8v operation, and the STM32F072
it's connected to operates its GPIO at 3.3v. suggestions on how to deal
with this appreciated.
l.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
For all following suggestions you need a 1.8v power supply (buck
converter). First, you could disable internal pullups on the stm and remove
all pullups on PCB2 for the signals from the battery ic. Because the
signals are probably all opendrain you just need to pullup the signals on
pcb3 to 1.8v; either the stm or the battery ic can pull the lines low to
"activate" them. The stm should recognize 1.8v as high ...
Second, you could add a txs0104 or two txs0102 (probably cheaper, you can
get those from aliexpress) for level shifting. They have internal pullups,
so you can remove the other pullup resistors as well.

yeahhh i was going to use a txs0104, but then decided to remove it from
the board... i'll put it back. there are a couple of other signals (the
IRQs) that need to be level-shifted up as well

*sigh* a 1.8v voltage regulator just for a few micro-amps... :)

Post by Internet
Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
btw annoyinly the BQ27542 is designed for 1.8v operation, and the
STM32F072 it's connected to operates its GPIO at 3.3v. suggestions on how
to deal with this appreciated.
l.
------------------------------
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook <http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEAAHqmkTZUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYqoFBSB8SASpWSvugQRJH0axlFAAGAjk/1/CyGju87Q28FjUXb8DSKQqQ/aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnBoY29tcC5jby51ay9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2FybS1uZXRib29r>

_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

ok turns out - from what i am reading of the datasheets - that the bq24193
can cope with running from 3.3v, it looks like it doesn't mind: the limit
of the I2C and other pins is 6V.

the bq27542 is a different matter (i thought it was 1.8v, it's not: it's
2.5v). it has its own 2.5v LDO on-board but the maximum input voltage is
2.5v for its I2C and HDQ (status / IRQ pin). sooo what i've done is,
connect the 2.5v output (REG25) to the level-shifter, and the other side to
VREFTTL.

i updated the schematics pdfs.

l.

[Internet]

I took another look and i am pretty satisfied with the results ;). However, a few things still need attention (i wrote it down on rhombus-tech.net)

Julius

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
ok turns out - from what i am reading of the datasheets - that the bq24193
can cope with running from 3.3v, it looks like it doesn't mind: the limit
of the I2C and other pins is 6V.
the bq27542 is a different matter (i thought it was 1.8v, it's not: it's
2.5v). it has its own 2.5v LDO on-board but the maximum input voltage is
2.5v for its I2C and HDQ (status / IRQ pin). sooo what i've done is,
connect the 2.5v output (REG25) to the level-shifter, and the other side to
VREFTTL.
i updated the schematics pdfs.
l.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
I took another look and i am pretty satisfied with the results ;).

yeah, thank you for encouraging me to do it.

Post by Internet
However, a few things still need attention (i wrote it down on
rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEAAHq9bWRkAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYquow53AL_eKiTEKLFD2cPfS26wAGAjk/1/8CS5JnYHwfGJh6YxzsKZ1g/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQ>
)

ok let's go through them:

PCB3 - Power Board

- connect thermistor for BQ24193 USB OTG Charger between BAT_NTC and GND
(not TS which is wired to the fuel guage)

yep, cut/paste error there


- change DVCC to SYS-V (otherwise LEDs won't work)

yep done

- pin 2 of connector J2 (to PCB1) should go to VCC-5V0 (we need power
for the EOMA68 card)

ah no. rrright, the way it works is:

* EOMA68 Card Power is actually "OTG-like". as in, you should expect it to
be *reversible* on demand, because there could actually be an OTG charger
plugged into the card, providing power *in* to the Housing. this is why
the SY6280 is required.

* the laptop's main components need a *separate* 5.0V power rail, for the
USB Hub, Audio, LCD, USB2 connectors etc. etc.

* power could actually come *in* through the EOMA68-5V0 line and has to go
*in* to VBUS... which... argh, is missing so that needs sorting.

* power can also go *out* through the EOMA68-5V0 line (from VBUS) when the
bq24193 is put in "boost" mode (this is for OTG power compliance) ... which
is missing and entirely defeats the purpose of *using* the bq24193 in the
first place :)

*sigh* so still have to sort that out, creating a two-way power path
between VBUS and EOMA68-5V0 at *specifically* 5.0v, coping with 1.5A
sustained current, and under user-control... preferably without using too
many components. SY6280's are my favourite "power cutting IC". there's
one spare pin on PCB3 J4 which could be used to control its enabling.

my first guess at a circuit would be a schottky diode pointing from
EOMA68-5V0 to VBUS to act as "power in to VBUS" and the SY6280 to act as
"power out". however, a *five amp* power regulator is going to be needed
on VIN to ensure that the input voltage never exceeds 5V (which it could at
the moment).

thoughts appreciated.

.

[Internet]

The power issue is pretty tough I think. Do you want to allow charging
from both sides (12v dc jack and eoma-5v0) or does the power from the
card only act as additional power for the system (without charging and
just taking the load off the battery)? How do you want to control the
power switch (SY6280) and detect whether the card is passive or active
(taking power/providing power)?

These are just a few thoughts I wanted to share 


Julius

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
I took another look and i am pretty satisfied with the results ;).
yeah, thank you for encouraging me to do it.
However, a few things still need attention (i wrote it down on
rhombus-tech.net
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEAAHq9bWRkAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYquow53AL_eKiTEKLFD2cPfS26wAGAjk/1/8CS5JnYHwfGJh6YxzsKZ1g/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQ>)
PCB3 - Power Board
* connect thermistor for BQ24193 USB OTG Charger between BAT_NTC and
GND (not TS which is wired to the fuel guage)
yep, cut/paste error there
* change DVCC to SYS-V (otherwise LEDs won't work)
yep done
* pin 2 of connector J2 (to PCB1) should go to VCC-5V0 (we need
power for the EOMA68 card)
* EOMA68 Card Power is actually "OTG-like". as in, you should expect
it to be *reversible* on demand, because there could actually be an
OTG charger plugged into the card, providing power *in* to the
Housing. this is why the SY6280 is required.
* the laptop's main components need a *separate* 5.0V power rail, for
the USB Hub, Audio, LCD, USB2 connectors etc. etc.
* power could actually come *in* through the EOMA68-5V0 line and has
to go *in* to VBUS... which... argh, is missing so that needs sorting.
* power can also go *out* through the EOMA68-5V0 line (from VBUS) when
the bq24193 is put in "boost" mode (this is for OTG power compliance)
... which is missing and entirely defeats the purpose of *using* the
bq24193 in the first place :)
*sigh* so still have to sort that out, creating a two-way power path
between VBUS and EOMA68-5V0 at *specifically* 5.0v, coping with 1.5A
sustained current, and under user-control... preferably without using
too many components. SY6280's are my favourite "power cutting IC".
there's one spare pin on PCB3 J4 which could be used to control its
enabling.
my first guess at a circuit would be a schottky diode pointing from
EOMA68-5V0 to VBUS to act as "power in to VBUS" and the SY6280 to act
as "power out". however, a *five amp* power regulator is going to be
needed on VIN to ensure that the input voltage never exceeds 5V (which
it could at the moment).
thoughts appreciated.
.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
The power issue is pretty tough I think. Do you want to allow charging
from both sides (12v dc jack and eoma-5v0)

yes.

Post by Internet
or does the power from the card only act as additional power for the
system (without charging and just taking the load off the battery)?

no. an OTG cable into the EOMA68 Card should be capable of charging (not
necessarily *running* the system as it's far too much current required).

Post by Internet
How do you want to control the power switch (SY6280) and detect whether
the card is passive or active (taking power/providing power)?

usual OTG software detection, then communicated (quickly) to avoid any
current bun-fights. OTG generates IRQs from the cable being plugged in
(usual way) - the extra bit will be to ensure that the required GPIOs are
pulled high/low - there's quite a few.

l.

[Internet]

I have found an interesting looking solution for USB C on the internet.
This is from a datasheet of a USB C Power Delivery controller and should
also be useful for the laptop because current be transferred in two
different directions as well. The setup uses different MOSFETS for
controlling the current and has the ability to route it to a different
location depending on the current direction. However, you still need a
switch (in this case two but they are complementary). Additionally, you
could use this to charge the battery and separate it from the rest of
the system, if power is incoming from the card, and if the card needs
power, you can simply switch it to the 5v system which should be
constantly connected to the battery (boost converter).

You can find it on page 20 in the top left corner in this
(http://www.cypress.com/file/140976/download) datasheet.

Julius Lehmann

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
The power issue is pretty tough I think. Do you want to allow
charging from both sides (12v dc jack and eoma-5v0)
yes.
or does the power from the card only act as additional power for
the system (without charging and just taking the load off the
battery)?
no. an OTG cable into the EOMA68 Card should be capable of charging
(not necessarily *running* the system as it's far too much current
required).
How do you want to control the power switch (SY6280) and detect
whether the card is passive or active (taking power/providing power)?
usual OTG software detection, then communicated (quickly) to avoid
any current bun-fights. OTG generates IRQs from the cable being
plugged in (usual way) - the extra bit will be to ensure that the
required GPIOs are pulled high/low - there's quite a few.
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

You can find it on page 20 in the top left corner in this (http://www.cypress.com/file/140976/download) datasheet.

ok that link came with adverts attached on gmail so it's here:
http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/001-93639_CCG1_Datasheet_USB_Type-C_Port_Controller_with_Power_Delivery.pdf

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-netbook@

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68


On Sat, Feb 25, 2017 at 3:07 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

You can find it on page 20 in the top left corner in this (http://www.cypress.com/file/140976/download) datasheet.

http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/001-93639_CCG1_Datasheet_USB_Type-C_Port_Controller_with_Power_Delivery.pdf

yyyehhhh.... lots of Power P-FETs and N-FETs... about 4 or 5 that i
can count.... not a big fan of that kind of design strategy, i much
prefer the simplicity of integrated solutions, not least that they
save quite a lot of space.

except of course they have to do _exactly_ what you need...

thanks julius - was there an app note / reference design around?

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachment

[Internet]

I agree that integrated solutions are better but maybe i find one which has that kind of power fets already in it.

There is no application note but luckily here (http://www.cypress.com/documentation/reference-designs/ccg1-type-c-legacy-usb-device-cable-paddle-card-reference-schematics) is a reference design for download. I am not too sure, though, if that helps.

Julius

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
On Sat, Feb 25, 2017 at 3:07 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Internet
You can find it on page 20 in the top left corner in this

(http://www.cypress.com/file/140976/download) datasheet.
http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/001-93639_CCG1_Datasheet_USB_Type-C_Port_Controller_with_Power_Delivery.pdf
yyyehhhh.... lots of Power P-FETs and N-FETs... about 4 or 5 that i
can count.... not a big fan of that kind of design strategy, i much
prefer the simplicity of integrated solutions, not least that they
save quite a lot of space.
except of course they have to do _exactly_ what you need...
thanks julius - was there an app note / reference design around?
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Internet]

After thinking a while about it I would say the SY6280 is probably the
simplest solution of all. However, for the required functionality you
would need two of them to route the power accordingly (one switch for
charging, one for powering the card)…

Julius

Post by Internet
I agree that integrated solutions are better but maybe i find one
which has that kind of power fets already in it.
There is no application note but luckily here
(http://www.cypress.com/documentation/reference-designs/ccg1-type-c-legacy-usb-device-cable-paddle-card-reference-schematics
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAH4-ipEUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYsTeTzX6MPuPYQhKY_qkUCi15RQAGAjk/1/oSBGCdhMdUg-7vJCsXJuTA/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5jeXByZXNzLmNvbS9kb2N1bWVudGF0aW9uL3JlZmVyZW5jZS1kZXNpZ25zL2NjZzEtdHlwZS1jLWxlZ2FjeS11c2ItZGV2aWNlLWNhYmxlLXBhZGRsZS1jYXJkLXJlZmVyZW5jZS1zY2hlbWF0aWNz>)
is a reference design for download. I am not too sure, though, if that
helps.
Julius
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAH4-ipEUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYsTeTzX6MPuPYQhKY_qkUCi15RQAGAjk/2/l8e1ZMiKl8WkDxY2KBfePw/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY3Jvd2RzdXBwbHkuY29tL2VvbWE2OA>
On Sat, Feb 25, 2017 at 3:07 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
You can find it on page 20 in the top left corner in this
(http://www.cypress.com/file/140976/download
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAH4-ipEUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYsTeTzX6MPuPYQhKY_qkUCi15RQAGAjk/3/_js_-ClBaoAwJhG9AFLMfw/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5jeXByZXNzLmNvbS9maWxlLzE0MDk3Ni9kb3dubG9hZA>)
datasheet.
http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/001-93639_CCG1_Datasheet_USB_Type-C_Port_Controller_with_Power_Delivery.pdf
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAH4-ipEUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYsTeTzX6MPuPYQhKY_qkUCi15RQAGAjk/4/zjDut4CbZFTeZoCr-DWzog/aHR0cDovL3Job21idXMtdGVjaC5uZXQvY29tbXVuaXR5X2lkZWFzL2xhcHRvcF8xNWluLzAwMS05MzYzOV9DQ0cxX0RhdGFzaGVldF9VU0JfVHlwZS1DX1BvcnRfQ29udHJvbGxlcl93aXRoX1Bvd2VyX0RlbGl2ZXJ5LnBkZg>
yyyehhhh.... lots of Power P-FETs and N-FETs... about 4 or 5 that i
can count.... not a big fan of that kind of design strategy, i much
prefer the simplicity of integrated solutions, not least that they
save quite a lot of space.
except of course they have to do _exactly_ what you need...
thanks julius - was there an app note / reference design around?
l.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
<http://t224.mjt.lu/lnk/AEMAH4-ipEUAAAAAAAAAAGbE2wkAASHlFNUAAAAAAAZHgABYsTeTzX6MPuPYQhKY_qkUCi15RQAGAjk/5/KaqJHoEUrk_QY0AWq2FBfA/aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnBoY29tcC5jby51ay9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2FybS1uZXRib29r>
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attach

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by Internet
After thinking a while about it I would say the SY6280 is probably the
simplest solution of all. However, for the required functionality you
would need two of them to route the power accordingly (one switch for
charging, one for powering the card)…

there's one already on PCB1.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.ph

[Internet]

Yeah, that is true. But the one on PCB1 only cuts power for the USB A ports. It does not act as power switch for the card to provide charging capability. To do that you need two of them on PCB3. One has 5v from the battery as input and the 5v ports of the eoma68 card as output, the other one has the 5v ports from the card as input and the output should be wired to the input of the usb otg charger ic (through a diode otherwise 12v would damage the card). If a usb otg cable is plugged in and the computing card switches the two complementary sy6280, power would go into the usb charger ic and charge the battery which also powers the rest of the system. Power from the system to the computing card would be off because the switch is open.

However, it won't charge from the card, if the 12v adapter is plugged in (because of the protection diode).

I will clarify this on the pcbs page but at the moment I don't have access to a PC.

Julius

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Internet
After thinking a while about it I would say the SY6280 is probably

the

Post by Internet
simplest solution of all. However, for the required functionality you
would need two of them to route the power accordingly (one switch for
charging, one for powering the card)


there's one already on PCB1.
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
Yeah, that is true. But the one on PCB1 only cuts power for the USB A
ports.

ah! then i'm thinking of the microdesktop, and haven't looked at PCB1
recently enough to remember that. i have a vague recollection of deciding
to move bidirection power-provision to PCB3.

Post by Internet
It does not act as power switch for the card to provide charging
capability. To do that you need two of them on PCB3. One has 5v from the
battery as input and the 5v ports of the eoma68 card as output, the other
one has the 5v ports from the card as input and the output should be wired
to the input of the usb otg charger ic (through a diode otherwise 12v would
damage the card). If a usb otg cable is plugged in and the computing card
switches the two complementary sy6280, power would go into the usb charger
ic and charge the battery which also powers the rest of the system. Power
from the system to the computing card would be off because the switch is
open.
However, it won't charge from the card, if the 12v adapter is plugged in
(because of the protection diode).
I will clarify this on the pcbs page but at the moment I don't have access to a PC.

honestly... it would be best done as a diagram, even if it's hand-drawn
and then photographed.

i recall tracking down the LT4155 (and then the bq24193 as its replacement)
precisely so that external components such as the SY6280's and extra
protection diodes *wouldn't be needed*. grrr :)

i _would_ suggest using the AXP209 or something else from X-Powers but i
don't believe they can handle this much current (4 to 5 Amps) - certainly
the AXP209 can only handle around 2A.

*sigh*...

l.

[Internet]

I added the suggested schematic to http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/ . A document from TI about routing power with load switches suggested basically the same except they used their own ics of course.

Hope this helps.

Julius

26. Februar 2017 13:13, "Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton" schrieb:
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68 (https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68)
On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 12:04 PM, Internet wrote:
Yeah, that is true. But the one on PCB1 only cuts power for the USB A ports.
ah! then i'm thinking of the microdesktop, and haven't looked at PCB1 recently enough to remember that. i have a vague recollection of deciding to move bidirection power-provision to PCB3.
It does not act as power switch for the card to provide charging capability. To do that you need two of them on PCB3. One has 5v from the battery as input and the 5v ports of the eoma68 card as output, the other one has the 5v ports from the card as input and the output should be wired to the input of the usb otg charger ic (through a diode otherwise 12v would damage the card). If a usb otg cable is plugged in and the computing card switches the two complementary sy6280, power would go into the usb charger ic and charge the battery which also powers the rest of the system. Power from the system to the computing card would be off because the switch is open.
However, it won't charge from the card, if the 12v adapter is plugged in (because of the protection diode).
I will clarify this on the pcbs page but at the moment I don't have access to a PC.
honestly... it would be best done as a diagram, even if it's hand-drawn and then photographed.
i recall tracking down the LT4155 (and then the bq24193 as its replacement) precisely so that external components such as the SY6280's and extra protection diodes *wouldn't be needed*. grrr :)
i _would_ suggest using the AXP209 or something else from X-Powers but i don't believe they can handle this much current (4 to 5 Amps) - certainly the AXP209 can only handle around 2A.
*sigh*...
l.

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by Internet
I added the suggested schematic to http://rhombus-tech.net/
community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/ . A document from TI about routing
power with load switches suggested basically the same except they used
their own ics of course.

got it. understand now. thx j

[zap]

I am curious, which processors are you considering by chance?

If no one can tell me that's fine, but I am just curious how much ram
the highest one is as a limit/whether it is 32 bit or 64 bit and how
late in the future such things are.

By the way, whenever I get around to it, I intend to, buy the libre
laptop, if systemd is really problem, I don't care if you want to remove
it as long as you do it well. :)

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phcomp.co.

[Adam Van Ymeren]

I believe the next generation of EOMA68 cards will use the Rockchip RK3288
SoC.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockchip_RK3288 for specs on that.

Post by zap
I am curious, which processors are you considering by chance?
If no one can tell me that's fine, but I am just curious how much ram
the highest one is as a limit/whether it is 32 bit or 64 bit and how
late in the future such things are.
By the way, whenever I get around to it, I intend to, buy the libre
laptop, if systemd is really problem, I don't care if you want to remove
it as long as you do it well. :)
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[John Luke Gibson]

And, Luke mentioned inquiries being made about using RISC-V in a 100%
open core board. That's probably a more longterm slightly optimistic
subject.

Post by Adam Van Ymeren
I believe the next generation of EOMA68 cards will use the Rockchip RK3288
SoC.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockchip_RK3288 for specs on that.

Post by zap
I am curious, which processors are you considering by chance?
If no one can tell me that's fine, but I am just curious how much ram
the highest one is as a limit/whether it is 32 bit or 64 bit and how
late in the future such things are.
By the way, whenever I get around to it, I intend to, buy the libre
laptop, if systemd is really problem, I don't care if you want to remove
it as long as you do it well. :)
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phco

[zap]

Post by John Luke Gibson
And, Luke mentioned inquiries being made about using RISC-V in a 100%
open core board. That's probably a more longterm slightly optimistic

ah okay fair enough. I was just curious if he planned to reverse
engineer ones with 8gb or more in the later future.

Post by John Luke Gibson
subject.

Post by Adam Van Ymeren
I believe the next generation of EOMA68 cards will use the Rockchip RK3288
SoC.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockchip_RK3288 for specs on that.

Post by zap
I am curious, which processors are you considering by chance?
If no one can tell me that's fine, but I am just curious how much ram
the highest one is as a limit/whether it is 32 bit or 64 bit and how
late in the future such things are.
By the way, whenever I get around to it, I intend to, buy the libre
laptop, if systemd is really problem, I don't care if you want to remove
it as long as you do it well. :)
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by zap

Post by John Luke Gibson
And, Luke mentioned inquiries being made about using RISC-V in a 100%
open core board. That's probably a more longterm slightly optimistic

ah okay fair enough. I was just curious if he planned to reverse
engineer ones with 8gb or more in the later future.

reverse-engineering i have come to the conclusion is a total - and
criminal - waste of time and effort. by the time all features are
100% stable it's several YEARS down the line. look at how long ago
the A64 was released, and the libdram code STILL HAS NOT BEEN
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

NO.

read this, zap:

https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop/updates/picking-a-processor

that should give you some idea of how insane pretty much every single
fabless semiconductor company really is. they're just not paying
attention: every single one of them makes at least one compromise,
somewhere, and because it's an *integrated* SoC there's absolutely
nothing that can be done about it.

so we need to be of the order of a MILLION units to be in a position
to influence these people. and if you're going for a million units,
you might as well get your own SoC custom-made.

anyone knows of an open silicon H.264 and MPEG design that is capable
of up to 1080p60 video decode, do let me know.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

http://opencores.org/project,bluespec-h264,overview

found the h264.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

https://opencores.org/project,video_systems,common

found a series of building blocks which look like they'll do the job
for MPEG, H261, H263, H264 and more. VP8 and VP9 are available "on
request" at zero licensing cost from google.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send

[zap]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by zap

Post by John Luke Gibson
And, Luke mentioned inquiries being made about using RISC-V in a 100%
open core board. That's probably a more longterm slightly optimistic

ah okay fair enough. I was just curious if he planned to reverse
engineer ones with 8gb or more in the later future.

reverse-engineering i have come to the conclusion is a total - and
criminal - waste of time and effort. by the time all features are
100% stable it's several YEARS down the line. look at how long ago
the A64 was released, and the libdram code STILL HAS NOT BEEN
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

Well at least I know now.

But I do recall you were talking about other processors even after that.

I must have been mistaken

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
NO.
https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop/updates/picking-a-processor

So Rockchip and A20 are the only ones you can do it too you think?

Ah okay. Well I hope something will change for you. though unlikely it
may seem.

and even more than that, I hope Trisquel 8 will someday come out of
alpha and support arm as a whole.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
that should give you some idea of how insane pretty much every single
fabless semiconductor company really is. they're just not paying
attention: every single one of them makes at least one compromise,
somewhere, and because it's an *integrated* SoC there's absolutely
nothing that can be done about it.

That bad huh? I had no idea that it was that frustrating.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
so we need to be of the order of a MILLION units to be in a position
to influence these people. and if you're going for a million units,
you might as well get your own SoC custom-made.
anyone knows of an open silicon H.264 and MPEG design that is capable
of up to 1080p60 video decode, do let me know.
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phcomp.co.u

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

as in it is a flagrant (colloquial "criminal") waste of time.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phco

[zap]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

as in it is a flagrant (colloquial "criminal") waste of time.

oh okay, would it support linux libre 4.9 from jxself's website by the way?

https://jxself.org/linux-libre/

I am wondering if it is possible to add that repository to a debian build.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachmen

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

as in it is a flagrant (colloquial "criminal") waste of time.

oh okay, would it support linux libre 4.9 from jxself's website by the way?

as i've said - approximately five to eight times now - repeated both
back in august, on the mailing list, and in the crowdfunding updates,
repeatedly, and yet again, repeatedly, back only as far as ten days
ago - nothing beyond 4.7rc4 works due to a mainline linux kernel bug
that has not been fixed during a major reworking of various parts of
the mainline sunxi.

please pay attention to the list messages before making me repeat
myself AGAIN, distracting me from tasks that take up my time.

please do not just dive in without keeping up-to-date and expect me
to repeatedly fill you in on missing information that's been repeated
five to eight times.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.

[zap]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

as in it is a flagrant (colloquial "criminal") waste of time.

oh okay, would it support linux libre 4.9 from jxself's website by the way?

as i've said - approximately five to eight times now - repeated both
back in august, on the mailing list, and in the crowdfunding updates,
repeatedly, and yet again, repeatedly, back only as far as ten days
ago - nothing beyond 4.7rc4 works due to a mainline linux kernel bug
that has not been fixed during a major reworking of various parts of
the mainline sunxi.
please pay attention to the list messages before making me repeat
myself AGAIN, distracting me from tasks that take up my time.
please do not just dive in without keeping up-to-date and expect me
to repeatedly fill you in on missing information that's been repeated
five to eight times.

I thought because it was linux libre, it would be different than the
normal kernel. I guess 4.4 or 4.1 may work better then...

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.

[zap]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

as in it is a flagrant (colloquial "criminal") waste of time.

oh okay, would it support linux libre 4.9 from jxself's website by the way?

as i've said - approximately five to eight times now - repeated both
back in august, on the mailing list, and in the crowdfunding updates,
repeatedly, and yet again, repeatedly, back only as far as ten days
ago - nothing beyond 4.7rc4 works due to a mainline linux kernel bug
that has not been fixed during a major reworking of various parts of
the mainline sunxi.
please pay attention to the list messages before making me repeat
myself AGAIN, distracting me from tasks that take up my time.
please do not just dive in without keeping up-to-date and expect me
to repeatedly fill you in on missing information that's been repeated
five to eight times.

I am beginning to suspect I have a weakness in that area. "Not Paying
attention"


My bad again. I really failed in that respect.

By the way, I hope you are feeling better.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phcomp.c

[John Luke Gibson]

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by zap

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

Wait its criminal?

as in it is a flagrant (colloquial "criminal") waste of time.

oh okay, would it support linux libre 4.9 from jxself's website by the way?

as i've said - approximately five to eight times now - repeated both
back in august, on the mailing list, and in the crowdfunding updates,
repeatedly, and yet again, repeatedly, back only as far as ten days
ago - nothing beyond 4.7rc4 works due to a mainline linux kernel bug
that has not been fixed during a major reworking of various parts of
the mainline sunxi.
please pay attention to the list messages before making me repeat
myself AGAIN, distracting me from tasks that take up my time.
please do not just dive in without keeping up-to-date and expect me
to repeatedly fill you in on missing information that's been repeated
five to eight times.

I am beginning to suspect I have a weakness in that area. "Not Paying
attention"
My bad again. I really failed in that respect.
By the way, I hope you are feeling better.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

@Zap, in this case verbosity helps greatly. If you (for all you
honestly knew at the time) redundantly mentioned the purpose of the
link was presenting jxself as an alternative.

In fact it would seem you were paying more attention than you (for all
Luke honestly knew at the time) seemed to be.

There is a lot of weight on what we are doing here, if we can forgive
each others tempers then we can forgive each others occasionally amiss
thoughts. This is more important than even slight drama, and certainly
TOO important for us to be letting each other feel down about our
slight mistakes.

*Zap recieves a big 'ole hug*

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send lar

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by John Luke Gibson

Post by zap
My bad again. I really failed in that respect.

's'ok zap

Post by John Luke Gibson

Post by zap
By the way, I hope you are feeling better.

getting there

Post by John Luke Gibson
@Zap, in this case verbosity helps greatly. If you (for all you
honestly knew at the time) redundantly mentioned the purpose of the
link was presenting jxself as an alternative.
In fact it would seem you were paying more attention than you (for all
Luke honestly knew at the time) seemed to be.

yeah yesterday wasn't a good day: i learned that the NAND ICs which
are currently available are no longer compatible with the NAND BOOT
ROM on the A20. the A20's basically running out of time and i will
have to make a decision to put sub 1GB NAND ICs on-board to store the
bootloader *only*, and ship with MicroSD cards with the OS on it
instead.

the passthrough card i can't get it up and running in a
straightforward fashion: it's going to take time.

the microdesktop is going to need a rework as the microsd power
supply 3.3v line is back-feeding into VREFTTL of the A20 and
destabilising the processor. i'll need to put in high-speed
bi-directional level shifters. argh.

the rk3288 is almost up and running: i destroyed one processor and
RAM with a short between the 2v and 1.5v supply, and the first board i
had working will not talk to the SYR827 or anything else on the PMIC
I2C Bus. i have three remaining boards spare which i am slowly in the
process of double-checking the I2C bus first, before putting on the
SoC and then the $40 worth of DDR3 RAM. each IC added is risky.

all this was yesterday.

so i am Not A Happy Bunny.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-netb

[jah]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
all this was yesterday.
so i am Not A Happy Bunny.

You're doing good work. Be gentle with yourself.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachm

[zap]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by John Luke Gibson

Post by zap
My bad again. I really failed in that respect.

's'ok zap

Post by John Luke Gibson

Post by zap
By the way, I hope you are feeling better.

getting there

Post by John Luke Gibson
@Zap, in this case verbosity helps greatly. If you (for all you
honestly knew at the time) redundantly mentioned the purpose of the
link was presenting jxself as an alternative.
In fact it would seem you were paying more attention than you (for all
Luke honestly knew at the time) seemed to be.

yeah yesterday wasn't a good day: i learned that the NAND ICs which
are currently available are no longer compatible with the NAND BOOT
ROM on the A20. the A20's basically running out of time and i will
have to make a decision to put sub 1GB NAND ICs on-board to store the
bootloader *only*, and ship with MicroSD cards with the OS on it
instead.
the passthrough card i can't get it up and running in a
straightforward fashion: it's going to take time.
the microdesktop is going to need a rework as the microsd power
supply 3.3v line is back-feeding into VREFTTL of the A20 and
destabilising the processor. i'll need to put in high-speed
bi-directional level shifters. argh.
the rk3288 is almost up and running: i destroyed one processor and
RAM with a short between the 2v and 1.5v supply, and the first board i
had working will not talk to the SYR827 or anything else on the PMIC
I2C Bus. i have three remaining boards spare which i am slowly in the
process of double-checking the I2C bus first, before putting on the
SoC and then the $40 worth of DDR3 RAM. each IC added is risky.
all this was yesterday.
so i am Not A Happy Bunny.

I am sure you will figure out a way. I wish you well and hope you will
find that one idea to fix your problems.

As for the ram I wanted, 4gb is a good amount, I needn't be greedy now.
Besides, someday down the road later in the future, who knows what will
happen...

For now though, don't be hard on yourself okay?

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
l.
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phc

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by zap
I am sure you will figure out a way. I wish you well and hope you will
find that one idea to fix your problems.
As for the ram I wanted, 4gb is a good amount, I needn't be greedy now.
Besides, someday down the road later in the future, who knows what will
happen...

the A20 maxes out at 2GB RAM, but the boot ROM only recognises
*older* (legacy) NAND ICs. the RK3288 maxes out at 4GB RAM and has a
modern eMMC interface, it's a completely different story.

Post by zap
For now though, don't be hard on yourself okay?

thx zap - you too jah.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send larg

[Siarhei Siamashka]

On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 10:42 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by zap
oh okay, would it support linux libre 4.9 from jxself's website by the way?

as i've said - approximately five to eight times now - repeated both
back in august, on the mailing list, and in the crowdfunding updates,
repeatedly, and yet again, repeatedly, back only as far as ten days
ago - nothing beyond 4.7rc4 works due to a mainline linux kernel bug
that has not been fixed during a major reworking of various parts of
the mainline sunxi.

As a matter of fact, there are dozens of other A20 based boards
and they all work with the current mainline kernel. Many people
are using them, so the test coverage is pretty decent.

I would not rule out some sort of defect in your hardware.
For example, it has been recently discovered that some boards
have wrong capacitors (10uF instead of 4.7uF) and this causes
reliability problems:

https://lists.denx.de/pipermail/u-boot/2017-March/282796.html

And this was just a single example. There are tons of possible
reasons why the hardware may not work correctly. And there will
be no progress until somebody gets his hands dirty and finds
the root cause.

[Siarhei Siamashka]

On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 6:22 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
reverse-engineering i have come to the conclusion is a total - and
criminal - waste of time and effort. by the time all features are
100% stable it's several YEARS down the line. look at how long ago
the A64 was released, and the libdram code STILL HAS NOT BEEN
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

You are just very poorly informed about the status of A64 support.
And it's quite funny that there are people who believe you rather
than trying to get this information first hand.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments

[Paul Boddie]

Post by Siarhei Siamashka
On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 6:22 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
reverse-engineering i have come to the conclusion is a total - and
criminal - waste of time and effort. by the time all features are
100% stable it's several YEARS down the line. look at how long ago
the A64 was released, and the libdram code STILL HAS NOT BEEN
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

You are just very poorly informed about the status of A64 support.
And it's quite funny that there are people who believe you rather
than trying to get this information first hand.

Well, I posted the results of some enquiries a few weeks ago in the context of
the Olimex laptop. Everything sounded very promising until this appeared:

"For the moment the only working Linux Kernel which supports all A64 features
is the Allwinner Android Kernel. This Kernel is full of binary blobs, but the
only one which could be used for demo. Beside the binary blobs many other
things are broken, like the power management, different drivers like the LCD
backlight PWM, wake up from suspend, eDP converter is not set properly and
works just in 15 bit color mode etc etc. We have the hardware for 50 laptops
ready (developer edition), but we do not want to ship before we take care for
the software. At other hand we do not want to ship TERES I with Android or
RemixOS also which are complete with binary blobs and will never be Open
Source."

Source: https://olimex.wordpress.com/2017/02/07/fosdem-and-teres-i-update/

Some of that is specific to their laptop, but some of it seems relevant to any
A64 device. Maybe you could reconcile what the Olimex people are saying with
what you are claiming.

If you have any definitive information to the contrary, particularly about the
boot0 code that Luke appears to be referring to, please post links to it. The
linux-sunxi wiki was very vague on such matters last time I checked. And yes,
I have seen the "mainlining effort" page:

https://linux-sunxi.org/Linux_mainlining_effort#Status_Matrix

Paul

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Se

[Siarhei Siamashka]

Post by Paul Boddie

Post by Siarhei Siamashka
On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 6:22 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
reverse-engineering i have come to the conclusion is a total - and
criminal - waste of time and effort. by the time all features are
100% stable it's several YEARS down the line. look at how long ago
the A64 was released, and the libdram code STILL HAS NOT BEEN
REVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake.

You are just very poorly informed about the status of A64 support.
And it's quite funny that there are people who believe you rather
than trying to get this information first hand.

Well, I posted the results of some enquiries a few weeks ago in the context of
"For the moment the only working Linux Kernel which supports all A64 features
is the Allwinner Android Kernel. This Kernel is full of binary blobs, but the
only one which could be used for demo. Beside the binary blobs many other
things are broken, like the power management, different drivers like the LCD
backlight PWM, wake up from suspend, eDP converter is not set properly and
works just in 15 bit color mode etc etc. We have the hardware for 50 laptops
ready (developer edition), but we do not want to ship before we take care for
the software. At other hand we do not want to ship TERES I with Android or
RemixOS also which are complete with binary blobs and will never be Open
Source."
Source: https://olimex.wordpress.com/2017/02/07/fosdem-and-teres-i-update/
Some of that is specific to their laptop, but some of it seems relevant to any
A64 device. Maybe you could reconcile what the Olimex people are saying with
what you are claiming.

I guess, the emphasis was on *all* A64 features. And the mainline kernel
clearly does not support *all* A64 features yet.

Also Olimex people are always saying that they don't do software and
don't have software expertise in-house. The are not the best people
to ask for this information.

Post by Paul Boddie
If you have any definitive information to the contrary, particularly about the
boot0 code that Luke appears to be referring to, please post links to it.

Regarding Luke's claim stated in bold letters, here is the commit in the
mainline U-Boot, which has added the A64 DRAM controller support:

http://git.denx.de/?p=u-boot.git;a=commitdiff;h=1bc464be1fc559a3f6dc1334297245d5b27b9b57

But the reverse engineered A64 DRAM controller support code existed
in experimental git branches many months before it finally landed
upstream and anyone could try it.

Post by Paul Boddie
The linux-sunxi wiki was very vague on such matters last time I checked.
https://linux-sunxi.org/Linux_mainlining_effort#Status_Matrix

It's very good that you have found this page. You can clearly see
many links to the work-in progress branches that are used for
developing various drivers and test them.

If you don't understand something, you can always join the #linux-sunxi
irc channel on freenode and ask around.

[Paul Boddie]

Post by Siarhei Siamashka

Post by Paul Boddie
https://olimex.wordpress.com/2017/02/07/fosdem-and-teres-i-update/
Some of that is specific to their laptop, but some of it seems relevant
to any A64 device. Maybe you could reconcile what the Olimex people are
saying with what you are claiming.

I guess, the emphasis was on *all* A64 features. And the mainline kernel
clearly does not support *all* A64 features yet.

Sure, it wasn't good enough for a demonstration. But that doesn't need *all*
features, either. Yes, I agree that it's not their focus and that they just
want to demonstrate the hardware.

As people have noted before, it isn't always that helpful if such a hardware-
only focus continues through to retail because people can end up with hardware
that they cannot support themselves, with software that violates the licensing
terms.

Post by Siarhei Siamashka
Also Olimex people are always saying that they don't do software and
don't have software expertise in-house. The are not the best people
to ask for this information.

Well, there was someone who appeared to be "in the know" replying to questions
on their blog, so I was rather going off what they were saying. I don't expect
the Olimex people to know the details, but I do expect them to know whether
they can ship compliant software or not.

Post by Siarhei Siamashka

Post by Paul Boddie
If you have any definitive information to the contrary, particularly
about the boot0 code that Luke appears to be referring to, please post
links to it.

Regarding Luke's claim stated in bold letters, here is the commit in the
http://git.denx.de/?p=u-boot.git;a=commitdiff;h=1bc464be1fc559a3f6dc133429
7245d5b27b9b57

Thank you for posting this reference.

Post by Siarhei Siamashka
But the reverse engineered A64 DRAM controller support code existed
in experimental git branches many months before it finally landed
upstream and anyone could try it.

I did see this on the A64 page:

"U-Boot 2017.03-rc1 saw the addition of the required DRAM init code, so SPL
support is now enabled. However this version lacks support for loading the
ATF, which limits the usability."

https://linux-sunxi.org/A64#Mainline_U-Boot

It was found under the empty boot0 section, so I guess one is supposed to read
the page like a switch statement in the C programming language or something.

Post by Siarhei Siamashka

Post by Paul Boddie
The linux-sunxi wiki was very vague on such matters last time I checked.
https://linux-sunxi.org/Linux_mainlining_effort#Status_Matrix

It's very good that you have found this page. You can clearly see
many links to the work-in progress branches that are used for
developing various drivers and test them.
If you don't understand something, you can always join the #linux-sunxi
irc channel on freenode and ask around.

Well, I don't track Allwinner SoC support at all, really, but I thought that
since we had the opportunity to get to the bottom of this matter, it might be
best to ask someone who clearly has information about it. Publishing such
information in obvious places is more helpful than having people "ask around",
though, because it saves everyone time and reduces their confusion.

To that end, I added the following page to the Rhombus Tech wiki so that
people have the ability to inform themselves more conveniently on the topic:

http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner/a64/

Naturally, corrections and improvements are welcome.

Paul

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-netbook

[zap]

I know, I was talking more long term. but yes that is a good thing too.
until it goes beyond. heh.

any idea when the next generation ones will be announced or available
for purchase? ;)

Post by Adam Van Ymeren
I believe the next generation of EOMA68 cards will use the Rockchip
RK3288 SoC.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockchip_RK3288 for specs on that.
I am curious, which processors are you considering by chance?
If no one can tell me that's fine, but I am just curious how much ram
the highest one is as a limit/whether it is 32 bit or 64 bit and how
late in the future such things are.
By the way, whenever I get around to it, I intend to, buy the libre
laptop, if systemd is really problem, I don't care if you want to remove
it as long as you do it well. :)
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
<http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook>
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Bill Kontos]

Its a huge performance boost compared to the a20. I remember the gpd
handheld with the same soc can run emulators with 3d accel up to approx ps2
levels of graphic requirements and even run windows 10 relatively smoothly.
The CHIP community has managed to make ps1 games to run only with software
acceleration from the Neon simd extensions( on a different Allwinner soc).
The question is, how many of the features the soc has will work out of the
box with a vanilla kernel.

Post by Adam Van Ymeren
I believe the next generation of EOMA68 cards will use the Rockchip RK3288
SoC.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockchip_RK3288 for specs on that.

Post by zap
I am curious, which processors are you considering by chance?
If no one can tell me that's fine, but I am just curious how much ram
the highest one is as a limit/whether it is 32 bit or 64 bit and how
late in the future such things are.
By the way, whenever I get around to it, I intend to, buy the libre
laptop, if systemd is really problem, I don't care if you want to remove
it as long as you do it well. :)
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

julius it occurred to me from your comments that you may have been
reviewing the wrong PCB3 schematic, as the latest revision PCB3 includes a
4A buck-boost converter that ups the 3.8-4.2v battery output to 5.0V.
could you confirm that you've been reviewing the schematics that include a
TPS63020, the BQ24193, and the BQ27542?

l.
.

[Internet]

Yes, I have been reviewing the correct schematics. That is why I corrected the connector specification for PCB3.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
julius it occurred to me from your comments that you may have been
reviewing the wrong PCB3 schematic, as the latest revision PCB3
includes a
4A buck-boost converter that ups the 3.8-4.2v battery output to 5.0V.
could you confirm that you've been reviewing the schematics that include a
TPS63020, the BQ24193, and the BQ27542?
l.
.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by Internet
Yes, I have been reviewing the correct schematics. That is why I corrected
the connector specification for PCB3.

ah great, i just wasn't sure which ones i'd uploaded.

l.

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

ok soooo on laptop_15in_PCB1_rev2_2.pdf quadrant 2D page 1 you have
the STM32F072 board connector (to PCB2) and quadrant D1 you have the
power connector (to PCB3). that connector's fairly straightforward,
except the names should be VCC-5V0 not SYS-V. or, more to the point:
SYS-V on laptop_15in_PCB1_rev2_2 *is* VCC-5V0.

now let's look at laptop_15in_PCB2_3.pdf. J6 is where things aren't
properly synchronised as i hadn't completed the redesign. here - pin
10 - *really is* SYS-V from PCB2's J4 - because it's the "incoming
battery voltage" which powers the STM32F072 board's 3.3v regulator,
that power *must* remain permanently on, as the STM32F072 needs to be
permanently powered (so that it can monitor battery status interrupts
etc.) it also supplies (as 3.3v) the VREFTTL for PCB3 for any digital
GPIO...

*sigh* which is why i had the level converter on-board PCB3 because
all the STM32F072's GPIO is @ 3.3v, whilst the TI ICs are @ 1.8v.

it must also stay in control of all the power for the main laptop -
that's why 5V_EN is connected to PCB3's J4, and you can see from
PCB2's J6 i haven't yet updated the names of the pins.

yes the battery-sense thing is weird: you musn't connect the battery
directly to GND, you have to do that via a rather heavy-duty very
accurate 0.01R resistor, use differential-pairs to wire up the
current-sensing, make it very very pretty and completely symmetrical,
so that there's no chance of EM interference even the slightest little
bit with that hyper-sensitive voltage reading (microvolts) going into
the battery-sense IC.

all not yet completed etc. etc.

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@files.phcomp.co.

[rohbeck--- via arm-netbook]

Haha, just my thought. My first impulse was "Zen @4W, yay!".0 0
------ Original message------From: Luke Kenneth Casson LeightonDate: Wed, Mar 1, 2017 20:22To: Linux on small ARM machines;Cc: Subject:Re: [Arm-netbook] Arm processors
On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 12:49 AM, zap wrote:>>> On 03/01/2017 06:58 PM, John Luke Gibson wrote:>> And, Luke mentioned inquiries being made about using RISC-V in a 100%>> open core board. That's probably a more longterm slightly optimistic>> ah okay fair enough. I was just curious if he planned to reverse> engineer ones with 8gb or more in the later future. reverse-engineering i have come to the conclusion is a total - andcriminal - waste of time and effort. by the time all features are100% stable it's several YEARS down the line. look at how long agothe A64 was released, and the libdram code STILL HAS NOT BEENREVERSE-ENGINEERED. it's 200 lines of code for fuck's sake. NO. read this, zap: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop/updates/picking-a-processorthat should give you some idea of how insane pretty much every singlefabless semiconductor company really is. they're just not payingattention: every single one of them makes at least one compromise,somewhere, and because it's an *integrated* SoC there's absolutelynothing that can be done about it.so we need to be of the order of a MILLION units to be in a positionto influence these people. and if you're going for a million units,you might as well get your own SoC custom-made. anyone knows of an open silicon H.264 and MPEG design that is capableof up to 1080p60 video decode, do let me know.l._______________________________________________arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.ukhttp://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbookSend large attachments to arm-***@files.phcomp.co.uk

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_(microarchitecture)

surely you don't mean the zen processors from AMD which have a TDP of
65 or 95 watts and have over a thousand pins and a heatsink almost
four times the size of the PCMCIA Cards themselves....

is there any other processor which fits the description of "zen"
which is less ambiguous from a google search? do you have a direct
link to what you're referring to?

thanks rob.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@file

[rohbeck--- via arm-netbook]

No, the rumor mill has it that Zen will scale down to 4W/core 
------ Original message------From: Luke Kenneth Casson LeightonDate: Thu, Mar 2, 2017 01:21To: ***@yahoo.com;Cc: Linux on small ARM machines;Subject:Re: [Arm-netbook] Arm processors
---crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 9:14 AM, ***@yahoo.com wrote:> Haha, just my thought. My first impulse was "Zen @4W, yay!".0 0https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_(microarchitecture) surely you don't mean the zen processors from AMD which have a TDP of65 or 95 watts and have over a thousand pins and a heatsink almostfour times the size of the PCMCIA Cards themselves.... is there any other processor which fits the description of "zen"which is less ambiguous from a google search? do you have a directlink to what you're referring to? thanks rob.

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Post by rohbeck--- via arm-netbook
No, the rumor mill has it that Zen will scale down to 4W/core

that would be very cool (literally). hopefully that's not "4W @
200mhz clock speed"....

l.

_______________________________________________
arm-netbook mailing list arm-***@lists.phcomp.co.uk
http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
Send large attachments to arm-***@f