[Arm-netbook] early access EOMA68 to hardware for parabola ARM maintainers?

[Andreas Grapentin]

(I sent this message before, but I suspect it didn't get delivered
because I wasn't subscribed to the mailing list, so here I go again.)


Hello everyone,

I represent the hackers in charge of maintaining the parabola ARM port.

As you know, the 'libre tea' computer card will be shipped with parabola
preinstalled, and we are currently working hard on getting our ARM port in
shape. Unfortunately, at the moment we have two problems:

a) lack of compute resources - we need some actual ARM boards of the
right architecture to build - and especially test - packages

b) lack of information - we don't know enough about the particularities
of the EOMA68 cards to be able to tell how well our port works on them


Hence my question: would be possible for us to get early access to a
couple of the EOMA68 devices in advance, so that we can make sure that
our ARM port is up and running when the cards are to be shipped?

We are very excited about this project (many of us have actually
pre-ordered cards), and we want to be able to deliver the best possible
version of our GNU/Linux distribution that we can produce.

Best,
Andreas


--

[Allan Mwenda]

Yes Luke has a list somewhere for devs who want early access on his site. How many cards do you need?

Post by Andreas Grapentin
(I sent this message before, but I suspect it didn't get delivered
because I wasn't subscribed to the mailing list, so here I go again.)
Hello everyone,
I represent the hackers in charge of maintaining the parabola ARM port.
As you know, the 'libre tea' computer card will be shipped with
parabola
preinstalled, and we are currently working hard on getting our ARM port in
a) lack of compute resources - we need some actual ARM boards of the
right architecture to build - and especially test - packages
b) lack of information - we don't know enough about the particularities
of the EOMA68 cards to be able to tell how well our port works on them
Hence my question: would be possible for us to get early access to a
couple of the EOMA68 devices in advance, so that we can make sure that
our ARM port is up and running when the cards are to be shipped?
We are very excited about this project (many of us have actually
pre-ordered cards), and we want to be able to deliver the best possible
version of our GNU/Linux distribution that we can produce.
Best,
Andreas
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
https://files.grapentin.org/.gpg/public.key
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Pablo]

Post by Allan Mwenda

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Hence my question: would be possible for us to get early access to a
couple of the EOMA68 devices in advance, so that we can make sure that
our ARM port is up and running when the cards are to be shipped?

Yes Luke has a list somewhere for devs who want early access on his site.

Correct. I'm going to save you the time to search the vast archive of
the arm-netbook mailing list:

*Begin of shortened quote*
"Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2017 03:49:59 +0000
From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkclatlkcl.net>
Subject: [Arm-netbook] Mainlining the EOMA68-A20

i'm just talking to my host, here in taiwan, to use his equipment to
get 50 boards made up. i'll also get some RS232-UARTs and some
micro-desktops made as well... or perhaps some breakout boards and the
OTG-Host cables, have to see.

any takers please put alias down here so i get a quick idea of numbers
http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/ "

*End of shortened quote*

Some people including me signed up but when I last looked we are still far
from 50 boards.

Pablo

Post by Allan Mwenda

Post by Andreas Grapentin
(I sent this message before, but I suspect it didn't get delivered
because I wasn't subscribed to the mailing list, so here I go again.)

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[Andreas Grapentin]

Post by Pablo

Post by Allan Mwenda
Yes Luke has a list somewhere for devs who want early access on his site.

Correct. I'm going to save you the time to search the vast archive of

Thank you very much!

Post by Pablo
*Begin of shortened quote*
"Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2017 03:49:59 +0000
From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkclatlkcl.net>
Subject: [Arm-netbook] Mainlining the EOMA68-A20
i'm just talking to my host, here in taiwan, to use his equipment to
get 50 boards made up. i'll also get some RS232-UARTs and some
micro-desktops made as well... or perhaps some breakout boards and the
OTG-Host cables, have to see.
any takers please put alias down here so i get a quick idea of numbers
http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/ "

This looks very promising. I need to ask a couple more questions:

Could parabola as a whole go into that list, with a to-be-determined
number of cards, or would we need to name the individual hackers?

We have at least three people working on the arm port, maybe more. Would
asking for ~5 cards still be in the right ballpark?

Would the prototypes be lent to us? donated? sold?

Is there an ETA?

Best,
-Andreas

--

[Allan Mwenda]

Put in as many people as would be useful to your project. No other distro has come here with interest like you guys so I'd take advantage of that before it changes.
Didn't you have guys working on a handheld eoma console? Get them in on it as well.

Post by Andreas Grapentin

Post by Pablo

Post by Allan Mwenda
Yes Luke has a list somewhere for devs who want early access on his

site.

Post by Pablo
Correct. I'm going to save you the time to search the vast archive of

Thank you very much!

Post by Pablo
*Begin of shortened quote*
"Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2017 03:49:59 +0000
From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkclatlkcl.net>
Subject: [Arm-netbook] Mainlining the EOMA68-A20
i'm just talking to my host, here in taiwan, to use his equipment to
get 50 boards made up. i'll also get some RS232-UARTs and some
micro-desktops made as well... or perhaps some breakout boards and

the

Post by Pablo
OTG-Host cables, have to see.
any takers please put alias down here so i get a quick idea of

numbers

Post by Pablo
http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/ "

Could parabola as a whole go into that list, with a to-be-determined
number of cards, or would we need to name the individual hackers?
We have at least three people working on the arm port, maybe more. Would
asking for ~5 cards still be in the right ballpark?
Would the prototypes be lent to us? donated? sold?
Is there an ETA?
Best,
-Andreas
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
https://files.grapentin.org/.gpg/public.key
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Thu, May 11, 2017 at 4:34 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin

Post by Pablo
any takers please put alias down here so i get a quick idea of numbers
http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/ "

hi, sorry andreas, my mailer decided to move all arm-netbooks
messages to a folder without my consent after i changed the name of
the list a couple of days ago. bit of an "aiyaaa" moment, so thank
you to everyone who's been carrying on the conversation!
sure

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Could parabola as a whole go into that list, with a to-be-determined
number of cards, or would we need to name the individual hackers?

at some point i'll need an address and tel no and name for a courier,
the name on the page is just to get an idea of numbers and also
preferably put how you can be contacted (email address) if it's not
obvious

Post by Andreas Grapentin
We have at least three people working on the arm port, maybe more. Would
asking for ~5 cards still be in the right ballpark?

eek! that's quite a lot, but with something like... i forget exactly
how many but i believe it's like... 200 or so parabola cards, it's
probably a good idea.

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Would the prototypes be lent to us? donated? sold?

bear in mind that the prototypes are like of the order of $USD *200
to 250 each*, and also that courier costs as well as the prototype
production costs eat into the budget which is already getting tight,
the less amount of money that comes out of that budget the more is
available to help the project succeed. so i leave it up to you to
decide.

one thing: whatever happens, please do *not* just let the Cards sit
on shelves once you are done with them. if you're not going to use
them, *please find a home for them* and ask people to respect the same
thing. the idea is that these Cards have an ongoing recycled lifespan
until they literally fall apart, as they're part of an "Eco-Conscious"
angle of Computing Appliance Reuse.

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Is there an ETA?

couple weeks for the 2.7.4 revisions, that'll be QTY 10 which i'll
test out. ETAs during pre-production testing phases... you just
*cannot* give *any* guarantees whatsoever.

if this was the "production" phase then it would be a totally
different matter: there would be a set schedule (because the factory
has to slot everything in).

l.

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[Andreas Grapentin]

Hi Luke,

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
at some point i'll need an address and tel no and name for a courier,
the name on the page is just to get an idea of numbers and also
preferably put how you can be contacted (email address) if it's not
obvious

understood. I'll produce a list of hackers and contact info.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
eek! that's quite a lot, but with something like... i forget exactly
how many but i believe it's like... 200 or so parabola cards, it's
probably a good idea.

also understood. I will make sure that we only request the cards we actually
need. I will talk to the maintainers and make sure they are all in the loop. I
am confident we can get this number down a bit.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
bear in mind that the prototypes are like of the order of $USD *200
to 250 each*, and also that courier costs as well as the prototype
production costs eat into the budget which is already getting tight,
the less amount of money that comes out of that budget the more is
available to help the project succeed. so i leave it up to you to
decide.

also understood. I will try and source some budget so that parabole does not
produce any unnecessary costs.

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
one thing: whatever happens, please do *not* just let the Cards sit
on shelves once you are done with them. if you're not going to use
them, *please find a home for them* and ask people to respect the same
thing. the idea is that these Cards have an ongoing recycled lifespan
until they literally fall apart, as they're part of an "Eco-Conscious"
angle of Computing Appliance Reuse.

don't worry, I have literally dozens of projects in mind with those cards ;)

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
couple weeks for the 2.7.4 revisions, that'll be QTY 10 which i'll
test out. ETAs during pre-production testing phases... you just
*cannot* give *any* guarantees whatsoever.

allright, thanks for the info Luke, I will talk to our arm team again, make sure that everyone understands the things you told me, and then get back to you with a number, and then we will wait patiently for the cards to hit :)

thank you all for the awesome work you are doing!


Best,
-Andreas

--

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Sat, May 13, 2017 at 9:00 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin
don't worry, I have literally dozens of projects in mind with those cards ;)

awesome, look forward to hearing about it
l.

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[Andreas Grapentin]

Hi,

to pick up this discussion again, Parabola has concluded that we will
for the time being need only one preview card, and I will privately pay
for it in full.

following are the contact information for the hacker in question:
Andreas Grapentin (me) <***@grapentin.org>
Potsdam, Germany

I can provide a complete address through a more private channel :)

Best,
Andreas

--

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 7:26 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Hi,
to pick up this discussion again, Parabola has concluded that we will
for the time being need only one preview card, and I will privately pay
for it in full.

that would be fantastic. it's $USD 2000 a time or so to make 10
samples. i have 9 available working 2.7.4 samples and 9 microdesktop
v1.7 pcbs. if you have a usb-to-uart (usual FT232 thing will do) and
a soldering iron that would help. if not i might have one spare.
also if you can arrange pickup (e.g. DHL) that would be really
helpful.

very important: i will mark them as "sample of negligeable value" on
the cards themselves and on the customs form.

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Potsdam, Germany
I can provide a complete address through a more private channel :)

yes please.

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[Andreas Grapentin]

[...] it's $USD 2000 a time or so to make 10
samples. i have 9 available working 2.7.4 samples and 9 microdesktop
v1.7 pcbs.

So it's 200 $USD for one card plus microdesktop pcb? That is manageable.
Let me know where I should transfer the money and I will do that ASAP.

if you have a usb-to-uart (usual FT232 thing will do) and
a soldering iron that would help.

yup, plenty of those around.

also if you can arrange pickup (e.g. DHL) that would be really
helpful.

I am not sure what that entails - could you elaborate? I was assuming
the card would just be shipped to my home address. I am not familiar
with dhl pickup, and a quick search didn't produce anything useful.

very important: i will mark them as "sample of negligeable value" on
the cards themselves and on the customs form.

good, let's see how that goes. I'm consistently having trouble with
packages that go through customs; must be on some kind of watchlist.


-A

--

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 8:04 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin

[...] it's $USD 2000 a time or so to make 10
samples. i have 9 available working 2.7.4 samples and 9 microdesktop
v1.7 pcbs.

So it's 200 $USD for one card plus microdesktop pcb?

yyyeah roughly. i forget how much the microdesktop samples were but
it's nothing like the cost of the A20 samples. DHL will be... $50
maybe $70, i'll look it up.

Post by Andreas Grapentin
That is manageable.
Let me know where I should transfer the money and I will do that ASAP.

if you have a usb-to-uart (usual FT232 thing will do) and
a soldering iron that would help.

yup, plenty of those around.

awesome. one less thing for me to do. i'll take a photo so you have
the pinouts. just fyi if you look at the microdesktop longways with
the 20-pin 2.54mm DIL nearest to you and left-right it's GND in the
front right corner then TX/RX to the left of those, i forget which is
which.

Post by Andreas Grapentin

also if you can arrange pickup (e.g. DHL) that would be really
helpful.

I am not sure what that entails - could you elaborate? I was assuming
the card would just be shipped to my home address. I am not familiar
with dhl pickup, and a quick search didn't produce anything useful.

google "DHL scheduled pickup taiwan":
http://www.dhl.com.tw/en/express/shipping/pickup.html

mm.... depending on the bank account i might be able to just arrange
shipping: i'll have to talk to my partner to find out which bank
account has a means and method of paying DHL.

Post by Andreas Grapentin

very important: i will mark them as "sample of negligeable value" on
the cards themselves and on the customs form.

good, let's see how that goes. I'm consistently having trouble with
packages that go through customs; must be on some kind of watchlist.

if you're receiving a lot of stuff, regularly, and it's not a
business address then yeah they might get edgy. that being the case
it might be better to use Fedex. Fedex are much better: they handle
customs payment on your behalf and make damn sure to actually do what
they promise: deliver on time.

http://www.fedex.com/tw_english/pickup/

l.

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[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

btw i looove taiwan broadband, moving the laptop upped the speed to
1.5mb/sec. an error on my part resulted in the first time being
deleted, i'm doing a second one, it will be at
http://lkcl.net/parabola_armhf_eoma68.tgz

oo it's only 1.3gb yay (as if 1.3gb is any better... *sigh* i *really*
don't like distributing root filesystems, but hey...)

ok go for it andreas, give it a shot.

l.

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[Christopher Havel]

I know Europe's a whole different ball game -- but -- DHL "eCommerce"
shipping (invariably marked on the label as "DHL Global Mail") in the US is
the single slowest partnered-with-the-Postal-Service-for-cheaper-service
shipping medium that I've ever used. USPS Media Mail is faster! Heck,
ePacket from Hong Kong is borderline faster -- and DHL eCommerce is a
DOMESTIC service!
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[Andreas Grapentin]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
btw i looove taiwan broadband, moving the laptop upped the speed to
1.5mb/sec. an error on my part resulted in the first time being
deleted, i'm doing a second one, it will be at
http://lkcl.net/parabola_armhf_eoma68.tgz

Thank you, download is complete.

Could you verify that this sha256 sum is correct:
90678894608b8b7f6bb3aa8feedcc475d8b4b52d27f161046b182091967d3806 parabola_armhf_eoma68.tgz

Can't be careful enough :)

Thanks,
-A


--

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin
90678894608b8b7f6bb3aa8feedcc475d8b4b52d27f161046b182091967d3806 parabola_armhf_eoma68.tgz

***@dedi28:/var/ftp/lkcl.net# sha256sum parabola_armhf_eoma68.tgz
90678894608b8b7f6bb3aa8feedcc475d8b4b52d27f161046b182091967d3806
parabola_armhf_eoma68.tgz

looks good.

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[Pablo Rath]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 7:26 PM, Andreas Grapentin

...

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Parabola has concluded that we will
for the time being need only one preview card, and I will privately pay
for it in full.

that would be fantastic. it's $USD 2000 a time or so to make 10
samples. i have 9 available working 2.7.4 samples and 9 microdesktop
v1.7 pcbs.

I am also on the list for a preview card. I should be able to cover at
least a part of the costs to reduce pressure on myself.

...

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Potsdam, Germany

I live in Austria, a country with a border to Germany.
Would it save costs to send Andreas and my card together to Europe.
Afterwards he could mail my card with a standard postal sevice to Austria (costs around 10 €) or we could do it the other way round.
I would of course pay the shipping costs from Germany to Austria and
half of the costs from Taiwan to Germany.

kind regards
Pablo

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[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by Pablo Rath
I am also on the list for a preview card. I should be able to cover at
least a part of the costs to reduce pressure on myself.

that would be great

Post by Pablo Rath
I live in Austria, a country with a border to Germany.
Would it save costs to send Andreas and my card together to Europe.

mmmm if it can be insured for full value i would feel more
comfortable with that idea.

l.

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[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

andreas it would be really handy to have openrc, eudev and
nosystemd-compat added to parabola armv7h.
https://sourceforge.net/projects/mefiles/files/Manjaro/openrc-eudev/armv7h/
http://systemd-free.org/

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[Hendrik Boom]

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
andreas it would be really handy to have openrc, eudev and
nosystemd-compat added to parabola armv7h.

Just curious. What is nosystemd-compat? Is is something like
the libsystemd0 in Devuan that provides a dummy systemd interfae to
some programs that appear to depend on systemd to run without it?

-- hendrik

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[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

hiya folks,

whilst preparing an early 2.7.4 sample i tried the parabola image that
i have here, which worked well back in june-august 2016 and i have not
updated since. alongside XFCE4 i deployed eudev and openrc and it
works extremely effectively (and provides a faster boot time).

when endeavouring to do an update there were two key conflicts,
related to udev, systemd and mesa-gl attempting to be upgraded. the
upgrade could therefore not proceed.

now, i *might* have a micro-sd card which has the full XFCE4
pre-tested image on it: around that time i remember losing a couple of
pre-prepared images due to sdcard corruption thanks to NAND IC
interference. if i can find it that is what will have to go out...
but it will *not be upgradeable*.

could someone (on parabola) please check this out and see what's going on?
http://systemd-free.org/install.php

many many thanks,

l.

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[Andreas Grapentin]

Hi Luke,

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
when endeavouring to do an update there were two key conflicts,
related to udev, systemd and mesa-gl attempting to be upgraded. the
upgrade could therefore not proceed.

could you give us access to the image you used? that would make it
easier to find the issues.

However, due to some changes in arch, there is currently no clean
upgrade path from 2016 images that does not require manual intervention.
See here:
https://www.archlinux.org/news/ca-certificates-utils-20170307-1-upgrade-requires-manual-intervention/

there might be some more of these that I forgot.

Best,
-Andreas


--

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68


On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 7:23 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Hi Luke,

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
when endeavouring to do an update there were two key conflicts,
related to udev, systemd and mesa-gl attempting to be upgraded. the
upgrade could therefore not proceed.

could you give us access to the image you used? that would make it
easier to find the issues.

can do. one ironic thing: i cannot remember how i got eudev
installed! i.e. from which repo.

1.7gb upload... *shudder*. ok. i have space. it's going to take...
10 hours @ 40k/sec. will get back to you in a a few days as i do not
expect it to complete first time (rsync is my best friend here).

Post by Andreas Grapentin
However, due to some changes in arch, there is currently no clean
upgrade path from 2016 images that does not require manual intervention.
https://www.archlinux.org/news/ca-certificates-utils-20170307-1-upgrade-requires-manual-intervention/

yuck.

ok.

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[Vincent]

Yes, unfortunately I did press "reply" without noticing I was sending it
to you directly instead of the list. However, I did send another email
to the list as reply just a few seconds later.

Yes, I'm interested in the a20 pre-production boards.

You can add me with the following details:
Vincent, Germany, my-email-address

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68

Hi everybody,

you sent this to me only!

Please also add me to the early access list.
Since the project is experiencing some delays and I would like to move
on with my i.MX7 design, it would be really helpful to have an early
version as reference.

... of the a20? edit this and add some contact details / identifying
info that i will be able to reach you by
http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/

Thank you very much.
Best regards,
Vincent

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
---
crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 7:23 PM, Andreas Grapentin

Post by Andreas Grapentin
Hi Luke,

Post by Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
when endeavouring to do an update there were two key conflicts,
related to udev, systemd and mesa-gl attempting to be upgraded. the
upgrade could therefore not proceed.

could you give us access to the image you used? that would make it
easier to find the issues.

can do. one ironic thing: i cannot remember how i got eudev
installed! i.e. from which repo.
1.7gb upload... *shudder*. ok. i have space. it's going to take...
expect it to complete first time (rsync is my best friend here).

Post by Andreas Grapentin
However, due to some changes in arch, there is currently no clean
upgrade path from 2016 images that does not require manual intervention.
https://www.archlinux.org/news/ca-certificates-utils-20170307-1-upgrade-requires-manual-intervention/

yuck.
ok.
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[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

Post by Vincent
Yes, unfortunately I did press "reply" without noticing I was sending it
to you directly instead of the list.

whoops :)

Post by Vincent
However, I did send another email
to the list as reply just a few seconds later.

check archives. doesn't look like it made it.

Post by Vincent
Yes, I'm interested in the a20 pre-production boards.
Vincent, Germany, my-email-address

http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/ is a publicly-editable wiki,
can you please add yourself. thanks.

l.

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[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

dang i do not do mornings. feel like i've been dragged through a
hedge backwards and then had to stand upright in a force 10 gale.
means i'm not really thinking straight for at least a couple of hours.

ouaff.

ok. there are 9 available 2.7.5 samples in this round, they need to
be put to a use which will provide immediate benefit to the project
and to the users who have pledged for the crowdfunding. vincent can
you guarantee that you will aid and assist with promotion, software
development (on the A20 board) or anything else which would
immediately help the backers?

if not then apologies it will be necessary to wait for a less urgent
round (couple of months). or, i might be able to see if i still have
a 2.7.4 or earlier board.

l.

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